In message , Rod Bean
writes
Their 5 year reliability survey (14,000 replies), found that Sony were
best, Canon, Panasonic, Samsung middling, and JVC worst. They didn’t
test the Sony ‘39’ or ‘42’, but the DCR PC109E was the best buy
(‘£600’. Great video picture and sound quality’), with the
cheaper DCR HC40ES (‘£480’) as a close runner up.

The reliability survey is, to a degree, meaningless, since no camcorder
stays in production for more than 3 years (at best). The HC40 only hit
the streets about a year ago and AFAIR the PC109E a little over a year
ago. Sony seem to have a track record of replacing each model within
about a year.

Having said all that, my TRV30 is performing as well as on the day I
bought it more than 3 years ago, in spite of relatively heavy use.
--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info

In message , Rod Bean
writes

The main disadvantage as I see it of the HC39 is that the viewfinder,
which you might want to use instead of the ‘large, bright’ LCD in
order to conserve battery life, is only black and white. Would be very
interested to hear from David (Pearson) about battery life when using
the LCD and occasional zoom: I would be quite happy with say 1 hour. I
would prefer not to use the viewfinder as I find the B/w viewfinder on
my ancient current camera a real pain. I am also forever worrying
whether the batteries will run flat: spare batteries represent extra
bulk to carry around and are expensive.


Two thoughts. First, one of our sports organisers managed to get a full
hour's tape out of it in an evening on a football event, and the battery
was still alive - and that was using the LCD full-time I'd guess. So
about par - adequate but not a big battery. Second, the black and white
viewfinder on the HC39 is a fair point. I too the view that (a) casual
users such as my target user mainly use the LCD, and (b) arguably, a B&W
viewfinder is better - sharper, better contrast - than a colour one.
Look at pro camcorders and see how many have a colour viewfinder (he
guesses - just in case one of the residents shoots me down). Certainly
in my testing I didn't find the viewfinder a drawback.
--
David Pearson

David Pearson wrote:
In message , Rod Bean
writes


The main disadvantage as I see it of the HC39 is that the viewfinder,
which you might want to use instead of the ‘large, bright’ LCD in
order to conserve battery life, is only black and white. Would be very
interested to hear from David (Pearson) about battery life when using
the LCD and occasional zoom: I would be quite happy with say 1 hour.
I would prefer not to use the viewfinder as I find the B/w viewfinder
on my ancient current camera a real pain. I am also forever worrying
whether the batteries will run flat: spare batteries represent extra
bulk to carry around and are expensive.


Two thoughts. First, one of our sports organisers managed to get a full
hour's tape out of it in an evening on a football event, and the battery
was still alive - and that was using the LCD full-time I'd guess. So
about par - adequate but not a big battery. Second, the black and white
viewfinder on the HC39 is a fair point. I too the view that (a) casual
users such as my target user mainly use the LCD, and (b) arguably, a B&W
viewfinder is better - sharper, better contrast - than a colour one.
Look at pro camcorders and see how many have a colour viewfinder (he
guesses - just in case one of the residents shoots me down). Certainly
in my testing I didn't find the viewfinder a drawback.


Thanks very much David. I see AJ Electronics have the HC39 at £354.99,
compared to £449 in John Lewis, so am sorely tempted. All I need now is
some tips on persuading the wife that it is an essential purchase !

http://www.ajelectronics.co.uk

Regards

Rod

In message , Rod Bean
writes

Thanks very much David. I see AJ Electronics have the HC39 at £354.99,
compared to £449 in John Lewis, so am sorely tempted. All I need now
is some tips on persuading the wife that it is an essential purchase !

Naturally (and for the avoidance of doubt) I accept no responsibility
for my comments - which I would strenuously allege were made under the
influence of substances and circumstances various! But I have at least
used the thing and critically reviewed an hour's footage shot by an
inexperienced user (and it wasn't that bad). I'm waiting to see what
they brought back from a trip to Epsom last Friday at the mo'... Me -
I'll stick with another camera with more knobs - but I've been quite
impressed by this little thing.
--
David Pearson

Yup, that's he one...
Can't find reviews, but if you buy on a credit card, you should be insured..
no?
"Grumps" wrote in message
...
"Rod Bean" wrote in message
...
Craig

For some reason only just got your posting (below) , so the message I
posted a few minutes ago is a bit superfluous. Where did you find the
42 at sub £400? The cheapest I came across was Dixons.


http://www.prcdirect.co.uk/prc.filer...oducts/DCRHC42

But I'm not endorsing this site.

I think the 42 is quite a bit better, because of the LCD, the better
battery, and the DV In AND out..

I saw the 39 too, but seen too many people say the 42 is better.


"Rod Bean" wrote in message
...
Craig Lister wrote:
Thanks for that.

We're expecting a baby in September, so it's main use will be recording
it's
first few years. Widescreen is good, as I'd prefer that. I do do video
editing so hence the HC42 is my best option right now, as I need the
firewire in/out stuff....

Can you recommend competition to this. Same functions, different model?

Thanks,
Craig


"David Pearson" wrote in message
...

In message , Craig Lister
writes

Could anyone tell me if this is a good camera to get for family use?
I'd
like to be able to edit videos using firewire and then write to DVD.

Don't

think that has a baring on the camera though..

Does the camera perform well in indoor night lighting as would be used
in

a

lounge. Not pitch dark.


The HC39 - effectively the same model but without firewire/analogue in -
seems reasonable. The indoor performance is nothing wonderful to write
home about, but is pretty much par for a small (and relatively
inexpensive) camera (a bit of noise etc). Certainly in "indoor meeting
room" conditions I was happy with the performance. I'd only add that
its strength is if you're filming widescreen format - where the wide LCD
works well. For ordinary 4:3 format there may well be cheaper (similar,
older?) models available still.


And finally .. best price you know of in the UK ?


Google?
--
David Pearson



Craig

I have also been considering the HC42, but have recently been looking at
the similar HC39, because Amazon have it on offer at £369.88, compared
to £414.50 for the HC42 at Dixons on line. See:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/...704155-4342858
and
http://www.dixons.co.uk/product.php?sku=006199

The main disadvantage as I see it of the HC39 is that the viewfinder,
which you might want to use instead of the ‘large, bright’ LCD in order
to conserve battery life, is only black and white. Would be very
interested to hear from David (Pearson) about battery life when using
the LCD and occasional zoom: I would be quite happy with say 1 hour. I
would prefer not to use the viewfinder as I find the B/w viewfinder on
my ancient current camera a real pain. I am also forever worrying
whether the batteries will run flat: spare batteries represent extra
bulk to carry around and are expensive.

Can’t really advise re other makes, except that you might want to have a
look at this month’s ‘Which’ (local library?) as it contains a report on
camcorders. Their 5 year reliability survey (14,000 replies), found
that Sony were best, Canon, Panasonic, Samsung middling, and JVC worst.
They didn’t test the Sony ‘39’ or ‘42’, but the DCR PC109E was the
best buy (‘£600’. Great video picture and sound quality’), with the
cheaper DCR HC40ES (‘£480’) as a close runner up. Both models were
rated 4/5 for image and sound. Typically for a new Which report, both
these models have been discontinued. However, where available, they are
still expensive. Other models tested were from Panasonic, Samsung, and
Sharp.

So, decisions, decisions. I don’t really trust Dixons: read too many
bad reports on the internet, but have always found Amazon a brilliant
firm to deal with – fast, no quibbles about returning goods, and they
refund any postage if there is any problem! So I suppose it will be the
39 for me. Would be very interested to hear what you get and what you
think of it!

Best wishes with the baby - get some sleep while you still can !!!!

Regards

Rod

Thanks for the comments guys. Sounds as if I should perhaps be going
for the HC42. Off to (?) sunny Kent for a break shortly so will make a
decision next week.

Cheers

Rod

Rod Bean wrote:
Thanks for the comments guys. Sounds as if I should perhaps be going
for the HC42. Off to (?) sunny Kent for a break shortly so will make a
decision next week.

Cheers

Rod


One last posting - have just come across this interesting and detailed
US review of the HC42:
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content...der-Review.htm

Not sure how the HC42 differs from the HC42E, but I notice that the
cheap deals in the UK seem to be for the HC42, indicating that they are
not UK models. Will have to enquire further.


Rod

In message , Rod Bean
writes
Rod Bean wrote:
Thanks for the comments guys. Sounds as if I should perhaps be going
for the HC42. Off to (?) sunny Kent for a break shortly so will make
a decision next week.
Cheers
Rod


One last posting - have just come across this interesting and detailed
US review of the HC42:
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content...der-Review.htm

Not sure how the HC42 differs from the HC42E,

The 'E' suffix indicates "European", aka PAL. No 'E' suffix indicates
NTSC. Also those models with the 'E' suffix are covered by the
European-wide Sony warranty. Non-'E' are not (the have to be returned to
the US for warranty repairs.

but I notice that the cheap deals in the UK seem to be for the HC42,

You should check that you are buying (in the UK) the 'E' version.

indicating that they are not UK models. Will have to enquire further.

Some retailers (especially Internet retailers) omit the 'E' - though on
enquiry will confirm that they are indeed of the 'E' variant.

--
Tony Morgan
http://www.camcord.info